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 Post subject: Solo as Roxy, Roxy as solo?
PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2021 2:52 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 06, 2009 8:15 pm
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Location: Inverness, Scotland
To make the cognoscenti think again, have you ever listened to a Manzanera or Andy Mackay track and thought if only they had given that track to Bryan to do the lyrics and top line and make it a Roxy track like Amazona, Prairie Rose. Love Is The Drug, Still Falls The Rain etc.

Equally do you think some of the Roxy tracks would have been better off as solo tracks for either Bryan, Phil or Andy?

Solo tracks for me that would have been better as Roxy tracks:

Big Day
Flight 19
A Million Reasons Why
Green Spikey Cactus
Lorelei
You Go Up In Smoke
Another Time Another Place
This Island Earth
Boys And Girls
The Chosen One
New Town
Day For Night
Me Oh My
Lost
The Hour Before Dawn

J.O'B.


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 Post subject: Re: Solo as Roxy, Roxy as solo?p
PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2021 3:13 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 11, 2009 5:59 pm
Posts: 130
Good question, and one I’ve thought about a lot over the years.

In all honesty I can’t think of any BF tracks that wouldn’t be improved by having M and M on them: they always added significant “grit” to the end result. Just listen to Flesh and Blood live with both M and M elevating the song magnificently from fairly humdrum (Alan Spenner notwithstanding) to electrifying. They did a similar job in 2011 with To Turn You On, and of course Paul Thompson was on duty then too.

Side note: Paul Thompson has played Oh Yeah, Same Old Scene, Jealous Guy, More than This, Avalon, The Main Thing and To Turn You On live with Roxy since 2001 and those tracks were also lifted IMO.

It’s harder thinking about it the other way though: the solo albums during Roxy’s lifetime are what they are. I wish Eno had sung more vocals on Manzanera and Mackay albums; almost like a fantasy Roxy. I wish the Explorers had had more success...the first album in particular I prefer to any BF solo album.

In relatively more recent times though, it would have been interesting to hear BF sing on top of all of the 6PM and 50 Minutes Later albums (which are very nearly Roxy albums IMO), and similarly to hear BF sing on top of Mackay’s London, New York, Paris, Rome, and the Music for Senses album.


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 Post subject: Re: Solo as Roxy, Roxy as solo?
PostPosted: Tue Feb 09, 2021 8:09 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2012 10:58 am
Posts: 237
I think that quite a lot of the Explorers material could have been Roxy tracks, but then you have the problem about the lyrics ie not been written by BF. In particular I think that Ship of Fools, Crack the Whip and the epic Prussian Blue, with excellent playing by Andy, Phil and Steve Gadd) would make good Roxy tracks.

I've said before that up to 1975 there were similarities between Roxy, BF solo, AM solo, PM solo and Eno solo, mainly because the same musicians pwerformed on each others works. Perhaps Mainstream was the first major departure from this and then BF used a several new faces for IYM, although TGPT, Phil and John Wetton were present.


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 Post subject: Re: Solo as Roxy, Roxy as solo?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2021 10:42 am 
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Joined: Wed May 06, 2009 8:15 pm
Posts: 1025
Location: Inverness, Scotland
Roger wrote:
I think that quite a lot of the Explorers material could have been Roxy tracks, but then you have the problem about the lyrics ie not been written by BF.


I was asking the question in the context that if BF was given the backing tracks first for him to do lyrics and a top line and make it a Roxy song like he did for Bitter Sweet, Angel Eyes, While My Heart Is Still Beating, Prairie Rose etc.

I think if all the solo work was all used collectively to make Roxy Music records then we would have had 25-30 albums and that may have diluted the magic of what a Roxy Music album is.

Regards
J.O'B.


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 Post subject: Re: Solo as Roxy, Roxy as solo?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2021 8:36 am 
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Joined: Sun May 29, 2011 7:23 pm
Posts: 1568
Renowned Roxologists,

Although W2 is no expert on solo PM/AM works he is a staunch admirer of their musicianship.

That said, it would be a bold move to think of BF tracks that would be enhanced by their involvement where hasn’t already used them (they both appear on a number of his works).

W2 says this because BF is a master band leader. One of his key strengths is his ability to put together the band that can deliver precisely the sound he wants for that particular song at that particular moment in time. Windswept can’t think of many modern musicians who have that talent to the same extent. Or indeed the pulling power to secure their involvement.

Conversely, with regard to Roxy tracks that have been enhanced as BF solo works, Windswept can think of ‘Casanova’ and ‘2HB’ to name but two.

Indeed, when the history books are written, W2 thinks BF’s most important musical partner will have proved to be Colin Good.

The reason for this is because Good’s skills are highly complementary and have enormously enhanced arrangements, the recording process and live performances.

Salutations,

Windswept


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 Post subject: Re: Solo as Roxy, Roxy as solo?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 11, 2021 10:22 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2012 4:25 pm
Posts: 616
Location: Kempten
The Explorers:

- Venus De Milo
- Lorelei

(I always preferred this album to Boys + Girls and could imagine that Bryan had sung all the titles instead of James Wraith - who did no bad job one must say)

Eno:

- Cindy Tells Me
- On Some Faraway Beach
- Burning Airlines
- Mother Whale Eyeless
- The True Wheel
- I'll Come Running

Manzanera/801:

- Big Day
- Burning Airlines
- Miss Shapiro
- Green Spikey Cactus
- Technicolor Ufo

Andy Mackay:

- Summer Sun (way too much reverb on this track, Andy!)

Roxy Songs as solo:

- Cry Cry Cry
- Jealous Guy
- In The Midnight Hour

BF songs as Roxy:

- The 'In'-Crowd
- Party Doll
- Don't Stop The Dance (with Andy on sax/oboe)
- Kiss And Tell
- Limbo
- New Town
- Goddess Of Love
- One Way Love
- I Thought
- Song To The Siren
- No Face No Name No Number
- Loop De Li
- Midnight Train
- Driving Me Wild

IMNSHO - Stay healthy !! - Peter - 8-) :? ;)

PS: Forgot the Metaphors album - why not Bryan's voice on it?


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 Post subject: Re: Solo as Roxy, Roxy as solo?
PostPosted: Fri Feb 12, 2021 5:29 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 10, 2011 4:32 pm
Posts: 305
Chers amis!

While I´m drinking a glass of wine and listening to Nuits de Fourviére, I would like to add this.

Since long Bryan Ferry has been in the position where he can choose more or less freely which musicians to use for his projects. Having that in mind, I think it´s rather futile for us to "intervene". As most of you probably know, I am much more a ferryista than a roxymaniac. D´ailleurs, I strongly support le grand W2 opinion that Colin Good has been the most important musician for BF. It was Good that encouraged BF to explore the jazz domain.
Santé à tous! Let´s keep our fingers crossed that the pandemic will fade away before summer.


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 Post subject: Re: Solo as Roxy, Roxy as solo?
PostPosted: Sun Feb 14, 2021 7:45 pm 
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Joined: Sun May 29, 2011 7:23 pm
Posts: 1568
Oberon wrote:
Chers amis!

While I´m drinking a glass of wine and listening to Nuits de Fourviére, I would like to add this.

Since long Bryan Ferry has been in the position where he can choose more or less freely which musicians to use for his projects. Having that in mind, I think it´s rather futile for us to "intervene". As most of you probably know, I am much more a ferryista than a roxymaniac. D´ailleurs, I strongly support le grand W2 opinion that Colin Good has been the most important musician for BF. It was Good that encouraged BF to explore the jazz domain.
Santé à tous! Let´s keep our fingers crossed that the pandemic will fade away before summer.


Furloughed Ferryistas & Lockdown Lotharios,
Encore une fois, Oberon le magnifique has spoken words of wisdom and demonstrated consummate good taste.
The partnership between Ferry and Colin Good was the golden period in our hero’s history.
Salutations et bon vaccination ,
Windswept


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 Post subject: Re: Solo as Roxy, Roxy as solo?
PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:25 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jun 19, 2009 1:26 am
Posts: 1118
It's probably just a sign of my limited imagination, but I've always viewed the band's releases and the solo ones very much as separate entities (despite the interestingly reworked Roxy songs which appeared on the LST album).

Indeed, much as I love the Roxy repertoire, I would dearly love to follow a BF tour with its setlist drawn from his solo albums, which are full of underperformed gems. And don't get me started on the vapours which were brought on when LST occasionally crept into a Roxy setlist! ;)

Of course the problem is that floating concert goers (as opposed to us crusty old diehards) would probably withhold their cash from BF's tours if they thought they were going to be deprived of LITD, Jealous Guy & Avalon, so economics will probably ensure their retention.

Maybe the solo archives might stand more chance of being mined if BF ever performs some smaller group, more acoustic shows? Mind you, such opportunities have already been missed when he has had an orchestral backing from which the IYM & TBSB songs would have particularly benefitted.

I believe BF has intimated that he has little affection for IYM, which I find baffling. With Phil, TGPT & Wetton on board, it could easily have become the sixth Roxy album (although it might have been odd to hear the band perform it, as Spedding's guitar work is written through the songs like a stick of seaside rock).

By the same token '79-'82 era Roxy recordings have, to these ears, more in common with BF's post-'85 solo albums than they do with peak era (i.e. ('72-'76) Roxy. I've always felt like the other band members' contributions were a bit diluted after Roxy reformed. (I'll post my thoughts in the other thread on the "Ferry Is Roxy & vice versa" debate.)

As for the other members' solo albums, they are strong enough to stand on their own merits and I've never wondered for a moment what BF might have done with the songs. Over the past 45 years or so I've loved albums like Diamond Head, Eddie Riff & Warm Jets every bit as much as most of BF's albums.


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